Minutes from Meeting about DebConf16 Cape Town Bid Convened at 2014-11-12 19:33:13.481509 by tumbleweed in #debconf16-capetown on oftc Minutes ======= [19:33:13] STARTED (tumbleweed) [19:47:25] AGREED: indiebio to get UCT-approved prices out of breakwater (tumbleweed) [19:53:20] AGREED: indiebio to arrange meeting with Alex for a walkthrough (nattie) [20:09:58] AGREED: indiebio to investigate hotel schools (nattie) [20:26:19] AGREED: indiebio to harass someone in UCT about disabled access (tumbleweed) [20:30:19] ENDED (tumbleweed) Present ======= * ginggs * tumbleweed * highvoltage * confluency * madduck * wendar * drnlm * mwmwmwm * nattie * indiebio Raw Log ======= [19:33:13] tibid: start meeting about DebConf16 Cape Town Bid [19:33:13] * tibid gets out his memo-pad and cracks his knuckles [19:33:21] agenda: http://whiteboard.debian.net/9fcb2.wb [19:34:01] well, we've got the breakwater quote [19:34:21] I still need to enter that into the spreadsheet [19:34:31] also, a food quote for UCT main campus [19:34:34] I haven't looked at the venue checklist thing yet - in other words, I haven't walked around again yet [19:34:43] i'll just get the breakwater info [19:33:50] last meeting: https://wiki.debconf.org/wiki/DebConf16/Bids/Cape_Town/Minutes/2014-11-05#Minutes [19:36:54] ok, got, reading now [19:37:27] I haven't read it either, but just looking, the catering quotes say: 1 main course R170, 2: R195, 3: R220 [19:37:51] and because the restaurant is too small, they will have to set up a marquee tent, which will increase cost. [19:38:03] And I'm imagining if it rains this will be sub-optimal. [19:38:51] yeah [19:38:56] depending on how long the lunch break is, not everyone will be there at the same time, though [19:39:11] is using the internal catering obligatory if we go with Breakwater? [19:39:12] yes, we ate in shifts, this year [19:39:26] not formal shifts, but the dinner windows were 2 hours long [19:39:41] you'd get the initial stampede and the late stampede :) [19:39:53] ("oh no, dining hall's closing in 10 minutes!") [19:40:47] I think the internal catering would be obligatory. I can check, but I think that's how they make a lot of their income. [19:41:20] hotel rooms, cheapest is a quad unit at R2805, I think that's for the room, so divide that by 4. [19:41:27] single rooms R2092 [19:42:05] - mwmwmwm online [19:43:52] welcome mwmwmwm, you've just wandered into a team meeting :) [19:43:58] indiebio: I wondered on that, did they give us the university discount or not? [19:44:18] because, it's not the rate they give on the website for university events [19:44:24] it's double and higher :( [19:44:38] mwmwmwm: hi! [19:44:56] I don't think so. I think this is the independent rate. [19:45:15] does that mean we need to go back to them, now that we have UCT approval? [19:45:16] This was before I heard ginggs managed to get approval! So now I can go back. [19:45:26] hello stef [19:45:36] Also, I managed to deal with Alex, Michelle, my first contact, never came back to me. [19:45:38] tibid: minutes so far [19:45:38] Minutes available at http://corelli.tumbleweed.org.za/tibid-meetings/oftc-%23debconf16-capetown-2014-11-12-19-33-13 [19:45:40] mwmwmwm: ^^ [19:46:55] for the record and my ever fading brain, can you action that I go back to breakwater now, tumbleweed, please? [19:47:25] tibid: agreed indiebio to get UCT-approved prices out of breakwater [19:47:25] Agreed: indiebio to get UCT-approved prices out of breakwater [19:47:32] gaah, I really need to make anyone able to minute things [19:47:47] tumbleweed: i think i'm supposed to be able to - shall i try it with the next item? [19:47:53] you're welcome to [19:48:08] indiebio: and wave deputy vice chancellors signature at them [19:48:12] are there any other questions so long, wendar, or can I sommer write an email to Alex now already? [19:48:28] have you sent it to me, ginggs? Have you got it yet? [19:49:08] haven't got signed copies back yet [19:49:28] indiebio: did they give us quotes for the lecture theatres? [19:49:39] it seemed like we were missing some rooms [19:51:29] I haven't looked at it yet... [19:51:42] the AV equipment hire looks a bit expensive [19:51:45] I did see from a quick look the long exhibition hall... [19:52:04] are there maybe just one venue, representing others of identical size? [19:52:19] I think I'll have to go do another site visit, could do this on Friday... [19:52:27] that would be great [19:52:39] talking in person is probably helpful, too [19:52:43] yeah, AV stuff does look pricy. I'm sure we could get a better deal elsewhere [19:52:54] idea: would be good to meet with Alex then for a walk through [19:53:05] can i try to put that as an action item [19:53:20] tibid: agreed indiebio to arrange meeting with Alex for a walkthrough [19:53:20] Agreed: indiebio to arrange meeting with Alex for a walkthrough [19:53:24] \o/ [19:53:39] Welp, this is what happens when I keep missing meetings. ;) [19:53:59] \o/ [19:54:03] confluency: set a reminder? [19:54:03] confluency: happens in my choir too, one suddenly gets given solos if one misses rehearsals... [19:54:08] you get to be in charge of c&w meetings [19:54:11] i can imagine worse [19:56:16] indiebio: any agenda items of yours that we still need to cover? [19:56:31] indiebio: updating spreadsheet now, looks like I've entered Executive Room, Faculty Room, and Lecture Theatre, and they haven't given us prices. [19:56:42] those rooms came from their public room list [19:56:52] tumbleweed, I put the items in, are we on the same page? [19:57:10] indiebio: I mean, we've had a rambling discussion, if you want to focus on anything, raise it [19:57:11] all the other rooms we have prices for [19:57:21] 'K, catering... [19:57:51] ginggs told us earlier he contacted four catering firms and has a one reply back so far, but not a concrete quote [19:57:51] what are the ballpark prices per meal? I know we say cheapest and recommended, but what are our reasonable estimate based on previous years? [19:58:03] Are we looking at breakfast, lunch and dinner or what? [19:58:18] yeah, we are [19:58:30] though in a townie type venue, there will be fewer people around for dinner, IME [19:58:35] although maybe a fair number of people will choose to dine out [19:58:35] yes [19:58:42] tumbleweed: great minds ;) [19:59:19] given snacks (as all these conference packages seem to have), I can also see breakfast attendance being lower than lunch [19:59:35] are there other ways of saving money? e.g. if they are charging for plates etc, when des it make economic sense to buy our own cutlery/ plates, as a wild example? [19:59:43] yeah. breakfast doesn't really need to be elaborate for everyone [19:59:56] though i guess bigger breakfasts being available would also be OK [20:00:13] indiebio: in Nicaragua, we bought coffee mugs for all attendees [20:00:30] and in Portland we had the water bottles, but that's not catering as such [20:00:37] I saw enamel mugs yesterday, I want one :) [20:00:39] i'd imagine, hiring crockery is cheaper than buying it, but maybe not by much [20:00:53] also, where would the bought crockery go afterwards? [20:01:02] (guess we could donate it to a charity) [20:01:03] yeah, so after how many days does it make more sense to buy, and can one sell these as second hand, ever? [20:01:06] yeah [20:01:19] anyways, just thinking through options [20:01:25] There is a rental place in paarden eiland, but it really only makes sense [20:01:40] There's a bunch of costs around cleaning everything afterwards an such usually buried in the crockery hire prices, which would still need to be addressed [20:01:46] and I think that's all I wanted to discuss. [20:01:48] if we are also doing our own cooking ? [20:01:56] o/ (sorry for being late) [20:02:06] highvoltage: hola [20:02:19] I think given south african economics, doing our own cooking is uneccessary [20:02:20] I think as quotes come through I'll try load to git and then email the list [20:02:20] mwmwmwm: doesn't really happen at DebConf anymore, own cooking [20:02:31] (we never do that in the firsst world, where it costs 10x as much) [20:02:40] ain't nobody got time for cooking :P (I HATE cooking) [20:02:41] (though access to a kichen would be awesome) [20:02:49] I loff cooking. [20:02:57] i am cooking-ambivalent. [20:03:05] there, we've got the whole cooking-spectrum covered :) [20:03:05] although I guess switzerland's debconf-run bar had its own cooking [20:03:05] I will make you corsets if you cook for me [20:03:12] But maybe not catering on a massive scale. [20:03:19] .oO(raclette) [20:03:50] I would totes make my garlic cheese, but don't blame me if it leads to forking because people can't stand to be near each other afterwards. ;) [20:03:53] I ran a camp kitchen in Kenya for 100, but 200-300 is out of my league. :) [20:04:12] What I meant is that I was under the impression that catering outfits tend [20:04:20] confluency: rakija solves all those kind of problems [20:04:27] to provide cutlerly with not that much more prompting, so if you want to buy [20:04:42] yeah, I guess. [20:04:45] yeah, I'd imagine caterers have access to cutlery/crockery at good prices [20:04:53] or rent cutlery, then that would make sense if the caterers are left out [20:04:55] entirely [20:05:05] wendar: wow, that's already impressive [20:06:31] I think there are definitely ways to save costs around catering [20:06:42] but I also assume that this isn't going to be a huge portion of our budget [20:06:50] (except maybe for UCT upper campus) [20:07:00] so, we probably don't need to worry too much about it right now [20:07:27] although, it sounds like feed is going to cost about as much as accom? [20:07:49] debianites are hobbits [20:07:58] we like food [20:08:06] and we're also very happy with simple food [20:08:16] if only debianites had as awesome food songs :) [20:08:23] (nicaragua was amazing, and I'm assuming scary cheap) [20:08:47] I really liked everything about nicaragua. [20:08:59] Aren't there hotel schools around ... which somehow could be roped [20:09:04] in or rented or something ... [20:09:21] there are, actually! [20:09:35] someone please action me to go find out about hotel schools [20:09:41] talk to arbitraryuser? his wife is a chef [20:09:53] not sure if they get inundated by requests, but I'll go find out [20:09:58] tibid: agreed indiebio to investigate hotel schools [20:09:58] Agreed: indiebio to investigate hotel schools [20:10:06] thanks [20:10:15] ok [20:10:23] shall we discuss the bid document [20:10:28] would be quite fun to point conference goers at a large kitchen and [20:10:32] unfortunately cape town doesn't fit the 'africa is cheap' bit. [20:10:36] say "make what you like" ... [20:10:52] cheap, yes, but not insanely so [20:11:12] well, so far we're talking about EU 12-20 per day per person [20:11:15] that's cheap :) [20:11:50] what's that for? just food? [20:11:55] $ make pasta make: *** No rule to make target 'pasta'. Stop. [20:12:03] that's like coffee and lunch [20:12:04] indiebio: so is cape town not cheap compared to europe / us still? sorry, haven't been following the costing so I don't have a clue really [20:12:38] wendar: 12 would be cheap, 20 not so IMHO [20:12:50] not sure, I think we're a bit cheaper, but not as cheap as nicaragua would be. and more expensive than joburg and much more expensive than other african countries. [20:12:59] ftr, HD is about 12–15, depending on how you calculate [20:13:23] and, that's on the cheap side for Germany [20:13:35] that's very cheap [20:14:17] don't get me wrong, it's doable (12–20); I just wouldn't call it "cheap" ;) [20:14:56] I'd agree, Cape Town in general is doable, but not 'cheap'. [20:17:22] but we haven't been scraping the bottom of the pricing barrel, either [20:17:26] anyway [20:17:33] we need to get this bid done by the end of the month [20:17:58] madduck was saying we should aim to have all of location checklist covered by the end of the week [20:18:09] and aim for 10 days of bid polishing [20:18:11] sound about right? [20:18:11] ah, I didn't realise. [20:18:33] sounds reasonable [20:18:52] madduck: I don't mean to imply it's a steal, but it's not insanely high [20:18:58] rigt [20:19:00] right [20:19:24] OK, so I'm going to commit at least half of Friday to do venues, and then another half day next week. [20:19:55] and I'm going to spend some decent time on this, too [20:20:03] I keep saying that, though :( [20:20:15] yeah, year end is a bugger. [20:20:18] tumbleweed: shall i remind you at intervals? [20:20:28] tumbleweed: I've been out of touch, anything I could do? I'll have a day or two available next week for this [20:20:32] keeping conversation alive here is good for keeping motivation [20:20:50] +1 [20:20:53] highvoltage: reading over what we've got and looking for gaps would be helpful [20:21:04] wendar: will do [20:21:08] look at the location check list, and see what we aren't covering well [20:21:09] where's that git repository? [20:21:13] you've got a fresh set of eyes, so you'll see stuff we'll miss [20:21:23] http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/debconf-data/bid-capetown.git/ [20:21:31] there are clone URLs there [20:21:32] thanks [20:21:49] agreed, highvoltage [20:22:04] I look at those things and it all blurs... [20:22:41] ooh, indiebio even had to do a git merge [20:23:26] anything else that we have to discuss? [20:23:36] not intentional. [20:23:44] nothing from my side... [20:23:49] oh, when I was writing up the UCT venues, I thought we should get hold of someone in UCT staff who knows about disabled access [20:23:58] there's a department that handles disabled students, somewhere [20:24:12] I just heard montreal or something entered some date into their bid *gets all territorial* [20:24:40] I think the venues people will help with that. Hopefully they'll be more responsive now that we have approval [20:24:44] just want to add that I liked the muggs and nicaragua. and all the good signage everywhere. and the cheap (AND good) coffee [20:24:52] I think I'll go harass them in person on Friday morning. [20:25:09] indiebio: do you want an action for that? [20:25:31] erm, ya, why not [20:25:51] tibid: agreed, indiebio to harass someone in UCT about disabled access [20:25:51] tumbleweed: Sorry... [20:25:57] tibid: botslap [20:25:57] :( [20:26:19] tibid: agreed indiebio to harass someone in UCT about disabled access [20:26:19] Agreed: indiebio to harass someone in UCT about disabled access [20:26:35] be kind to your bot! [20:26:51] tibid: botsnack [20:26:51] * tibid nom nom [20:26:58] anything else? [20:27:04] hahaha, what just happened? [20:27:21] he didn't want the comma [20:27:32] and then you slapped him?? [20:27:54] it's ok, it's not nearly as violent as it sounds. [20:28:08] hahaha. wow. [20:29:32] I'll take that as nothing else [20:29:38] and we can call it [20:30:14] and we kept to exactly an hour. respect. [20:30:19] tibid: end meeting